Emma Rebellato
Right now, we're joined in the studio by shadow Foreign Minister, Ted O'Brien. Thanks for joining us this morning. What was your reaction when you heard this news? I mean, this could have been pretty bad.
Ted O'Brien
Well, I think the most important thing is we hear that the staff are accounted for, and I think that's the first thing people think about is just the safety of the people around so thank God that's the case, and the people of Geelong themselves, of course, will be particularly concerned.
Ted O'Brien
But it does come as yet another wake up call, a reminder that energy security really is national security. It makes me think of the second refinery we have in Brisbane, in Lytton, and I'm sure the Minister, when you speak to him later today, might be able to answer some questions about the security around those facilities. Hopefully, there was nothing sinister behind this, but only time will tell.
James Glenday
Yes, we did hear from fire fighters before they said, at this stage, it's not being treated as suspicious. Have successive governments led Australia down by not maintaining more refining capacity in Australia. I mean, we used to have, what, four, six, and you can look at the figures, the amount of refined fuel we produce in this country has absolutely fallen off a cliff over the past 15 or so years.
Ted O'Brien
Well, there's no doubt that we need to have greater sovereign capability when it comes to these things. Thankfully, under Angus Taylor, the two refineries we have were kept and that was because deals were made to ensure we did have refinery capability.
James Glenday
Multiple did close down, though?
Ted O'Brien
Multiple closed down under announcements under Labor and under the Coalition, which is why Angus Taylor had to stamp this out and stop it from happening. However, one of the real problems we have is we have such blockage around the drilling for oil in Australia, because unless we can unlock our capacity on oil, it undercuts the business case for having more refineries. So it's not just a matter of having refinery capability. It's also about ensuring we go upstream and we unlock the oil that we have underneath our feet.
Emma Rebellato
So how quickly? Let's say, let's say you're in government. You want to go ahead with this. How quickly could it all happen? How quickly will we have more supplies in the country?
Ted O'Brien
Well, we need to start drilling immediately. That's the starting point, which is why we have been critical of the government when it comes to not just oil, but gas also is just putting blocks in the way until you drill, you do not know what reserves are there to untap, that has to be the first priority.
James Glenday
The blockade is continuing in the Middle East. I mean, Donald Trump's blockading the Iranian blockade. If you had your way, would you really be sending Australian troops into that environment? Doesn't seem like many other countries at the moment are interested in doing that until there's a proper peace agreement?
Ted O'Brien
Well, James, Australia hasn't been called to join what the US is doing in terms of its own blockade. And so it's very much a hypothetical.
James Glenday
If you were in government, would you be offering?
Ted O'Brien
Well, again, if the US is not asking Australia to join efforts, you would wait to see what is requested of you. And the test you always apply in these things is, number one, is it in our national interest? Number two, do you have the capabilities to meet whatever, whatever is being requested? I note that the government is speaking with the US, the US, but again, the Prime Minister has said no request has been made. The UK and France are also leading discussions with other partners about the possibility of a coalition once there is peace to go through to stabilize the Strait of Hormuz.
Emma Rebellato
You're the shadow Foreign Minister, given what's been going on, if this drags on, do you fear Australia could also get dragged into this and be asked to take part?
Ted O'Brien
Emma, to be honest, I think Australia already is, and we are feeling that. It doesn't matter where you are in Australia, we are already being impacted, which is why our priority is to see the Strait of Hormuz stabilized so we can have freedom of passage, so we can have vessels travel through the Strait of Hormuz, because we are amidst an energy crisis, and unfortunately, Australia entered this crisis ill prepared, ill prepared economically, ill prepared from an energy perspective. And so having that strait opened is our priority. The longer this goes, the harder it's going to be. And you know, there's a small lag between this starting and people feeling it at the bowser. Unfortunately, once peace is found, there's going to be an even longer lag before we have stability within the market, the energy market, and so it is in our interest for a speedy resolution here.
James Glenday
The government's making announcements today about defence spending, boosting defence spending. I mean, this has been dripped out through the week. We're going to hear more from the Deputy Prime Minister later today. What's your reaction to this?
Ted O'Brien
Well, again, we look forward to seeing what the Deputy Prime Minister comes out with, but reports this morning leaves me with no confidence at all. This is meant to be a National Defence Strategy. It is sounding like a master class in creative bookkeeping. Basically, what the government is doing is they are taking expense items from elsewhere in government. It and putting it under the defense budget, such as military pensions, for example, you know you can't count military pensions as firepower, and so the claims of the government that it is now going to be able to match the Coalition's 3% of GDP commitment to defence spending is patently untrue, not if this is just purely creative accounting, which is what the reports this morning suggest.
Emma Rebellato
Let's talk about the immigration policy that the Coalition announced this week. Is this just about the by-election and getting votes back from One Nation?
Ted O'Brien
This isn't about votes. It's about values. And Angus Taylor has been very clear about this. This is about putting Australian values at the centre of our migration system, and I think that is critically important for all Australians.
The thing that excites me about this, Emma, to be honest with you, is if you look at how diversified we are as a people in Australia, there's one thing that has the capacity to unite us more than anything else, and that is a common set of values, Australian values. And so I think putting those values at the center of our migration system is actually a force for good, for unity, and will ensure that we not only protect Australians way of life, but also their living standards.
Emma Rebellato
Ted O'Brien, thanks so much.
